Venu-gita (4): SB 10.21.12-13, How to Do Bhajana

This audio is included in the following series of lectures:

Topics

• Discussion about Radha-Kunda and Govardhana babajis.
• Who are the husbands of the gopis.
• The beautiful simplicity of the gopis.
• What should be our mood and understanding in regards to the marriage of the gopis.
• How Srimad Bhagavad Gita is essential for preaching.
• When we have bhava we will learn to forget that Krsna is Bhagavan, the focus can then shift deeply to lilas of Vraja.
• How the gopis see the special good fortune of the wives of the demigods.
• When Krsna plays his flute, cows start to drink this nectar by their ears.
• What kind of mood did the calves and cows of Vrndavana have when the Krsna was young.
• Why would a sadhaka prefer to be like a cow.

Transcript

https://storage.googleapis.com/srila-gurudeva-archive/2108.mp3

[This lecture was spoken by Śrīla Bhaktivedānta Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja on October 3, 1992, in Mathurā.

Note: This transcript has the following editors’ inputs: the language has been slightly edited at some places, endnotes have been added, and additional text has been included in square brackets to facilitate the flow and understandability of the content. The verbatim transcript is available below the edited version.

If you are inspired to participate in the transcription sevā, please register at https://www.audioseva.com/register.]

EDITED

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Today, Rādhā-kuṇḍa bābājī,

Devotee: That one, I think that…

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Or first of Auḍulomī Mahārāja?

Devotees: Yes.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Yesterday, in evening he came, and he was here in night; he wanted to meet me. In the night, he came to me and asked some questions about Bhajana-rahasya that they [?] have given him to translate. [0:45–48 inaudible] And he was saying at the same time that he has approached gurus, ISKCON, for that…

Devotee: Feeding of sādhus.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: …feeding of sādhus. He told [me] that they [ISKCON gurus] were all accepted [agreed about] our program, but they said that we will consult with Nārāyaṇa Mahārāja.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: We also told him that we had to consult overseas people.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: It will be about me, then they said also that they have consulted with you, but you have not caught their this…[intention?], but like this.

Devotees: Laughing.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: They are not direct, understanding?

Devotee: Yes, yes completely.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: So why did you give them my name?

Devotee: Only him, because he kept telling me I should ask Nārāyaṇa Mahārāja, I should ask Nārāyaṇa Mahārāja. And yesterday he said, ‘What did Nārāyaṇa Mahārāja say? What did Nārāyaṇa Mahārāja say?’

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: I told them frankly; I also told to him.

Devotee: He understands, but he has been in Gauḍīya Maṭha for so long.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: But if my name had not been given, then it would have been better, but I don’t [2:25 inaudible]. I told them that they differentiate between Gauḍīya Maṭha and Gauḍīya. Themselves, [they are] bābājīs. They can take mahāprasādam with sahajiyās, and [with those of] very bad reputations. And not with Gauḍīya Vaiṣṇavas, who are very learned persons, very qualified, and who know how to do bhajana. They have left everything for Kṛṣṇa. But yet, they don’t take prasādam with them. And they tell that Gauḍīya Vaiṣṇavas have no guru-paramparā. If that is so, they can come to us, we can answer these questions. And you heard from them, and again you go to take money from them. This is [a] bad thing. We have no consideration about them.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: What did he say?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Bāt to ṭhik hai (It’s fine). It is right. I know that they will not agree. They will not leave their differences. So, we should not be sahānubhūti (empathize) with them. But, I have not…uh manā nahi kiyā (I did not forbid them), I have not…ki manā nahi (how do I say ‘manā nahi kiyā’?)...

Navīna Kṛṣṇa Prabhu: [translates manā nahi kiyā inaudibly]

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: But I have told the fact. Now they are free to do anything.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: The decision is theirs to make.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Huh?

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: The decision is theirs. If they are prepared to change their philosophy, then we can think about it.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Huh? Then. Hā, I think so. If they should transfer their… all their views, then we should. I’ve done so much good for them. For Rādhā-kuṇḍa and Govardhana. But yet, they are like serpents.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Mahārāja, we have a question.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: What?

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: We’re up to text 13, but we have a question about 12.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Hm, hm, boliye. Tell.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: We were, we were up...you have completed 12, and now you were going to do 13. But we have some questions.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: What? It was 12?

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: You remember.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Dharādharā? Hmm.

Devotee: 11 and 12.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Yeah. In 11 and 12 it’s mentioned; in 12, it mentions that the demigod ladies were flying in their airplanes with their husbands, and both were appreciating Kṛṣṇa. And the gopīs are thinking that certainly they are more fortunate than we, because our husbands will not permit us to leave to be with Kṛṣṇa or anything. So, there’s some question about who are the husbands of the gopīs? Sometimes it is said that they are cowherd boys. So surely they must love Kṛṣṇa very much, then why should they mind if their wives also are with Kṛṣṇa. Other times it is said that actually they have no real husbands, that Yogamāyā has manufactured a duplicate, some husbands who appear to be their husbands. And, any other possible? Like this, different things are said about husbands of the gopīs, so could you please clear? How is it that different statements are there about the gopīs’ husbands?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: You can answer? I want to see your answer.

Devotee: I think you should answer.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Hm, boliye (please say).

Devotee: I cannot answer.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Boliye to (please say)! What will be your answer?

Devotee: My answer is that we could ask you. That is my only answer. I have the same question.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Same question. You can answer. I know that you can answer.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: I asked the question.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: (Laughing) No, no, no but I know that you can answer. You can answer.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: We are all unable to answer.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: No, no, you can answer.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: We are like little parts in the presence of the sun. There’s no light.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: I know that you know the answer.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: I see that there are different explanations given.

Devotee: Also that one about that the gopīs get married to Kṛṣṇa. All the cowherd boys got married, so who did they marry, also?

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: They married Kṛṣṇa during the time, during Brahma-vimohana-līlā. There are different things are said about the husbands of the gopīs. You have told us that the gopīs have no husbands. In Goloka, they only have abhimāna, but actually there are no husbands. Then, one time you told that there’s no Abhimanyu and no Jaṭilā. And then, another time you said to us, without Jaṭilā how can there be Yāvaṭa? So, we have become puzzled by your different explanations.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: (Laughing) No, you should not be puzzled. You should know that this is madhura-līlā. Madhura-līlā is called, where there is aiśvarya or not aiśvarya, they will think only with the eyes of nara. Nara, you know?

Devotees: Human.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Human, only. No aiśvarya. Neither gopīs nor Kṛṣṇa at that time are sarva-antaryāmī.

Navīna Kṛṣṇa Prabhu (Śrīpāda Mādhava Mahārāja): [inaudible] They don’t…. [inaudible]

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: No, it means sarvajñā.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Hā, antaryāmī, they are not antaryāmī.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: All-knowing, all-knowing.

Devotees: Omniscient

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Gopīs are said to be not intelligent.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Simple girls.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Simple girls. Not as…

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: …society girls, like in Mathurā…

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: …city girls, no. Very simple. They don’t know anything. They are not so clever.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: They are very clever.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: No, no. Not clever, nothing of the sort. They are very simplehearted. So, they don’t know that Yogamāyā has any play [effect] on them. If they were aware that Yogamāyā does anything, then their mood would become aiśvarya. But, they have no idea that Yogamāyā is playing any…

Devotee: …part.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: …any part in this thing. ‘We are simple girls, and we have been married to other gopas. [They] simply don’t know what has become in this; they don’t know anything. And with that guise, in madhura-līlā, they are telling all these things. Understand my view? They don’t know that ‘we have been married to Kṛṣṇa’. They don’t know that ‘we have not [been] married to gopas’. They know only, at that time, that ‘we have married to other gopas; they are my husband, they are my sister in-law, or mother in-law’ – nothing [else]. But when a third person comes, like us, which has no gopī-bhāva; also like Vyāsadeva, also like Śukadeva or Nārada, they know all these details. They [the gopīs] know some details, but they don’t know [everything]. Otherwise, līlā will not take place.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: So, from our, from Nārada’s vision, what is the fact? From Nārada’s vision…

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Nārada’s vision?

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: From the vision of Nārada Muni, what is the fact?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: The fact is that they have been given in marriage to, not given marriage to gopas.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: That is the fact.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: That is the fact. But, what is real is that, what gopīs are seeing. What is this? So, Nārada, Śukadeva Gosvāmī, Vyāsa and all others cannot have so much bhāva as [exists in] gopī-bhāva. Because they can understand all these things. They are sarvajña, they know all the facts. So, Uddhava also has no bhāva as gopīs do. They are the only ones who have that bhāva. ‘We love Kṛṣṇa in stealing [secretive] way, not knowing anything. In a hidden manner, we are doing all these things’.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Now, some of the muni-carī gopīs, because they had not yet developed full prema, they got married and had some children. Who did they marry?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Gopas.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: They did get married. And who are those gopas?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Vraja gopas.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Not nitya-siddha gopas, also sādhana-siddha gopas?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: It may be. Anywhere has not [been] written all these facts, but we…what? Sāmañjasya karte hai (We reconcile).

Devotee: [We] have to reconcile everything somehow.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Hā, reconcile. But if gopīs knew that ‘we have been not married to other gopas’, līlā will be spoiled. If Kṛṣṇa knows that fact, also līlā will be destroyed.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: In Goloka Vṛndāvana, is there…?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: What is written in Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, we should know that first is true.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: What about Jaṭilā and Abhimanyu?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: They are also there. Gopīs are seeing them, for līlā. But as a third person. Taṭastha. Taṭastha you know?

Devotee: Neutral.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Neutral.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Neutral. Nothing. Like so. But for līlā it is essential, and it is true.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: So, gopīs can see them.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Gopīs will see.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: But others?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Others means Uddhava and all others.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Can they see Jaṭilā?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: They will see in another thing [way]. That is why Uddhava returned to Mathurā. Nārada Muni cannot enter in Vṛndāvana. And if Kṛṣṇa were always all-knowing, then He could not play like this. He is not playing, but doing actually all these things as a general boy, a cowherd boy.

Devotee: Ordinary.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Ordinary. He is doing, and all this has been done by Yogamāyā.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: That is why Brahmā and Indra became bewildered. They could not believe it.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: So we should think always when we read and then we remember, and do anything, do bhajana, that by the eyes of gopīs, we see. Otherwise, we cannot enter in this līlā. You should not think that Kṛṣṇa has married them, or there has been marriage not with gopas, and it is only by Yogamāyā’s action.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: But, Jīva Gosvāmī explains it for the general reader; he does explain it, Jīva Gosvāmī.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: But, if we accept Jīva Gosvāmī’s rule, all will be destroyed. He has tried to give the real thing, and that is why līlā will not do. [Understanding of tattva-vicāra can inhibit the experience of līlā.]

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: But for the purpose of explaining generally, in a siddhāntika way, then Jīva Gosvāmī’s explanations are valuable; but for entering into bhāva, they are not valuable?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: So, we take only the view of Viśvanātha Cakravartī Ṭhākura. He has not taken anything like that. Anything. Only to give answers for other persons, general persons, we should know Jīva Gosvāmī’s vicāra. But not for our practices.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Acchā, I agree. But for explanation to others generally.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Others, Jīva Gosvāmī. But, not for rasika-vaiṣṇavas. Don’t explain all these things to a rasika-vaiṣṇava, because he will have to forget all these things, and you will remember all these things. He cannot forget. He cannot enter.

[All laughing]

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Now you have sealed our lips by just saying that.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Yes. [Side comment to someone in Bengali]. Uddhava went to gopīs. He lived [there] so many months. But, he could not have that view. He wanted that view.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: He couldn’t forget.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: And that is why it has been told in Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam:

jñāne prayāsam udapāsya namanta eva
jīvanti san-mukharitāṁ bhavadīya-vārtām
sthāne sthitāḥ śruti-gatāṁ tanu-vāṅ-manobhir
ye prāyaśo ’jita jito ’py asi tais tri-lokyām
[ŚB 10.14.3]

Jñāne prayāsam udapāsya. Here, this has not been told for nirviśeṣa-jñāna, but for the jñāna that entails always remembering Kṛṣṇa as God of gods, that He is sarva-kāraṇa (cause of all), anādi (beginningless), Himself anādi. We have to forget all this. We’ll have to reach the level of those who want to be rasika and bhāvuka. And if we want to attain any of the four main bhāvas in Vraja: dāsya, sakhya, vātsalya, madhura – especially three [sakhya, vātsalya, madhura], we will have to not always do anuśīlana of Kṛṣṇa thinking He is the God of gods. We must not conceive of Him as tattva, as advaya-jñāna-paratattva. We have to not think all these things. Instead, we should always be reading and chanting and remembering the pastimes of Kṛṣṇa of Vraja. By doing so, we will know the tattva, how we have to take, or interpret, jñāna. All will come, and then we can enter in līlā. And if we always know that Kṛṣṇa is all, then everything will be [spoiled]. So Gītā is not so much required for rasika-vaiṣṇavas. Because, if we remember always Gītā, then we’ll have to remember that Kṛṣṇa is God of gods.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: But for preaching Gītā is helpful.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: [For] preaching, it is not helpful, but it is essential. Essential – for us. we are not rasika, not bhāvuka, not so, we have no bhāva. So, for us it is not harmful. And if anyone will have bhāva, then automatically everything [else] will go. Only bhāva will come. Bhāva, vibhāva, anubhāva, sāttvika, vyabhicārī will come, and it will enter inside. As [for example] Rūpa Gosvāmī, he has never described all these things. Jīva Gosvāmī has written everything everywhere, in Prīti Sandarbha also.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Did Jīva Gosvāmī do that because he has less vision, or because he was being…this was his duty to do for the conditioned souls?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: For conditioned souls he has done.

Devotee: He is establishing the sampradāya of Mahāprabhu.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Otherwise, he was in the same mood.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Same mood as Raghunātha dāsa Gosvāmī, but Raghunātha dāsa Gosvāmī has no interest in all these things.

Devotee: Only weeping.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Only Rūpa Gosvāmī is it [his focus] only.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: And Kṛṣṇadāsa Kavirāja Gosvāmī [was] saying Rūpa-Raghunātha.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Both, both. Jīva Gosvāmī first, and then Rūpa Gosvāmī, Raghunātha dāsa Gosvāmī.

Devotee: So much of Caitanya-caritāmṛta, all the philosophy of the Sandarbhas is in there.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: So, everything is of Sandarbhas. What in Sandarbhas he has written? All things he has taken in Caitanya-caritāmṛta. And, rasa-vicāra of Rūpa and Raghunātha. And, he has favored Rūpa-Raghunātha more than all these things.

​​śrī-rūpa-raghunātha-pade yāra āśa
caitanya-caritāmṛta kahe kṛṣṇadāsa
[CC Adi 4.277]

You should go up.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Text 13.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: 13 not 14?

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: 13.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: ​​So, when we read these chapters, we should forget all things that Kṛṣṇa and gopīs are Bhāgavatī and Bhāgavata. We should only take the view of gopīs. What Rūpa Gosvāmī has given.

gāvaś ca kṛṣṇa-mukha-nirgata-veṇu-gīta
pīyūṣam uttabhita-karṇa-puṭaiḥ pibantyaḥ
śāvāḥ snuta-stana-payaḥ-kavalāḥ sma tasthur
govindam ātmani dṛśāśru-kalāḥ spṛśantyaḥ

[Veṇu-gīta, verse 13]

(repeats)

gāvaś ca kṛṣṇa-mukha-nirgata-veṇu-gīta
pīyūṣam uttabhita-karṇa-puṭaiḥ pibantyaḥ
śāvāḥ snuta-stana-payaḥ-kavalāḥ sma tasthur
govindam ātmani dṛśāśru-kalāḥ spṛśantyaḥ

This [the previous verse] has been told about ‘devyo’ (the demigoddesses) – ‘devyo vimāna-gatayaḥ smara-nunna-sārā’. Kṛṣṇa-rūpa [Kṛṣṇa’s form], and Kṛṣṇa’s everything is an utsava (festival) for gopīs, for all, an utsava. Here, the devīs are sumati saubhāgyavatī – fortunate.

Devotee: Fortunate.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: They [the gopīs] are seeing [that the devīs are fortunate]. Actually devīs are not so fortunate.

Devotee: Not so fortunate.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Not so fortunate. No bhāva like this [like that of the gopīs]. They cannot see the līlās of Kṛṣṇa and gopīs. Also, they cannot come down to Earth. If they have so much bhāva for Kṛṣṇa, they could have come and joined in rāsa. Or after rāsa they can meet Kṛṣṇa, they can come down to Earth. But they cannot [or do not] come. But they [the gopīs] are seeing, if a deer, if a she-goat – she-goat, you know? Bakarī.

Devotee: Bakarī.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: The she-goat comes to Kṛṣṇa and is searching for something, to eat some grass at His feet, where Kṛṣṇa has kept His feet – and there is a very good grass there. She is just searching for grass. But the premavatī gopīs (the gopīs, who possess divine love) will see that, ‘Oh, see how fortunate they [the goats] are. They are going and they are giving their heads to Kṛṣṇa’s feet.’ She-goats have nothing, but yet they [the gopīs] will think [them to be very fortunate]. Later on in Veṇu-gīta we will see examples of this.
So, the gopīs are seeing various beings, like deer, which have no viveka (powers of judgement, discernment) at all. They are foolish, so foolish, they don’t know anything about prīti. But yet, they are loving Kṛṣṇa and hearing the flute’s sweet voice, and giving and dedicating their hearts to Kṛṣṇa. And, on other hand, most viveka-śīla (discerned), buddhimān (intelligent) [the heavenly damsels]...

Devotee: [3:58 inaudible].

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: …they are also coming to Kṛṣṇa. The special thing is that, seeing Kṛṣṇa, these devīs forget that they are sitting in the laps of their husbands. If a man sees his wife, that she is in love with any other person, he will be angry. And he will do anything. But in this case, the husbands are here, so the gopīs are thinking, ‘Oh, see how wonderful and great is the fortune of the devīs. In their previous births, they must really have done something, some good work or deed that they have found such a good husband.’

And they [their husbands] are seeing that they are loving Kṛṣṇa, a man other than them. He (Kṛṣṇa) is para-puruṣa [the other man]. Para-puruṣa. But yet, they [the demigod husbands] are thinking: ‘How fortunate we are that we have such wonderful wives, that they have so much prema for Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa is supernatural Godhead.

Devotees: Supreme God.

**Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: ‘…**Supreme God. And they have so much love for Kṛṣṇa. We are so fortunate that we are touching our wives and we have connection with our wives. So, we are so greatly fortunate.’ So, they don’t have any envy or anything for Kṛṣṇa.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: But the husbands of the demigoddesses were not actually [free of jealousy?]

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: No, gopīs are thinking this way. Whether the demigod husbands have (jealousy) or not, we’ll have to accept what the gopīs are telling. This means, they [the demigods] are seeing that they, their wives, are in their laps. And they are loving their wives, despite knowing all these facts [of how enamoured they are with Kṛṣṇa], and they think themselves very fortunate. Because they have some touch (connection) with their wives. They know that they [their wives] love so much that ‘we have not a particle of such love in us towards Kṛṣṇa’. We naturally have admiration for one who is more qualified than us, and especially if that person has some natural bhakti to Kṛṣṇa.

You come to me only for this. And, we love you all in return because you have kṛṣṇa-bhakti; otherwise we would have no mutual interest, nothing. If we know that that person has more kṛṣṇa-bhakti than us, we will do praṇāma and we will go and try to serve them.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: We are not merchants like that. You are thinking that we are merchants, but we are not choosing any…like this.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: I know. So their husbands are thinking like a bhakta.

Devotee: Anyway, we are only interested in getting back our hearts, we have come here to get back our stolen property.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: So, the nature of bhakti is like this. When one sees someone has love (and) affection for Kṛṣṇa, he gives everything to that. So, the demigods are thinking they are so fortunate: ‘We have such good quality wives; they have so much affection that all the flowers from their hair fall out. And they don’t know where they are. They saw Kṛṣṇa and they heard the flute svara (sound), and they became senseless in our laps. If we had so much affection for Kṛṣṇa, we would be very fortunate’. So they have so much honor for their wives. ‘But, in our case it is just the opposite,’ [the gopīs say]. If our husbands will hear, and will see, and if they will see, they can do anything. If we were devīs, we would have so much occasion to see Kṛṣṇa.’ The devīs won’t see, if they cannot come to Earth; they cannot join Kṛṣṇa’s pastimes, they cannot sparśa – touch the feet of Kṛṣṇa, they cannot bathe in Kṛṣṇa’s feet dust, but yet the gopīs say they are wonderfully fortunate and say they would be so fortunate to have such a birth, as demigoddesses.

Now, wherever their sight goes, they see only kṛṣṇa-uddīpanā. Gopīs see uddīpanā everywhere. The devīs are very clever [sophisticated], but the gopīs’ standard is so high. They saw everything of Vraja: trees, deer, persons, cows. They began to speak about the cows, how the cows are feeling. So, here, we are telling:

gāvaś ca kṛṣṇa-mukha-nirgata-veṇu-gīta…

[In Hindi] Keep track of the time. We should not go over an hour.

gāvaś ca kṛṣṇa-mukha-nirgata-veṇu-gīta
pīyūṣam uttabhita-karṇa-puṭaiḥ pibantyaḥ

‘Oh see, cows are so fortunate. They thought that we cannot be the wives of demigods, devīs. But, see how the cows are feeling – kṛṣṇa-mukha-nirgata-veṇu-gīta. Kṛṣṇa is playing on HIs flute, and from His vaṁśī is coming nectar, so the cows are drinking that. How are they drinking? By…

Devotees: Ears.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Ears. Their ears…

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Like cups.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Cups, but down. Ordinarily cows’ [ears are] down, but when they are hearing, they are like so [upright]. Why? Because they are like cups. ‘What we are hearing should not fall down,’ they think. Thus they raise their ears. Sometimes, they close their eyes and tears are coming. Also, milk is coming down automatically from their…

Devotee: Udder, u-d-d-e-r.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Udder. Automatically, but not for calf, calves. Pīyūṣam uttabhita-karṇa-puṭaiḥ pibantyaḥ – for milk to flow spontaneously is a symptom of vātsalya-rasa.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Like mother Yaśodā.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Mother Yaśodā. So, they are like mothers.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: It’s an anubhāva.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: It is an anubhāva specific to mothers. They, the cows, are of vātsalya-rasa. In Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam everywhere it is written like so. They have so much affection. Gopīs are seeing that for so many years, Kṛṣṇa is grazing them. He goes and comes with them and He also makes them bath in sarovara (lakes) and He milks them, sometimes do like this…

Devotee: Patting and petting.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Padding, padding.

Devotee: Petting, p-e-t-t-i-n-g.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Petting them. So naturally, with whom anyone lives, they have some relation and some prīti. Why Kṛṣṇa, He at firsts only goes to graze, only calves, in boyhood? In Vṛndāvana He goes with only calves, but afterwards in Nandagaon He takes cows and goes to graze. Why cows? Because, the calves that were with Kṛṣṇa, grazing, they became bigger. And they are accustomed to going with Kṛṣṇa. So when they become cows, they become pregnant for the first time and have their first bacchā [baby]. They cannot go with other, older persons. They want to go with Kṛṣṇa as they are used to daily going with Kṛṣṇa. So all the calves, up till now, when Kṛṣṇa went in paugaṇḍa [from five to ten years], they become cows. From boyhood, Kṛṣṇa used to [be] petting them and show[ing] much love [and] affection for them. Now those calves have become cows, yet they had so much prīti for Kṛṣṇa, and as cows now they also have prīti for Krsna, but as mothers. So, cows are like mothers, affectionate to Kṛṣṇa, and giving milk.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: I have a question. When they were small calves, what was the loving mood they had?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Who?

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: When the cows were small, when Kṛṣṇa was taking them out when He was young in Vṛndāvana, what was the mood of those small calves? What kind of rasa?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: No rasa. As girls…

Navīna Kṛṣṇa Prabhu (Śrīpāda Mādhava Mahārāja: sakhya-rati.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: …sakhya-rati. After, they have rasa. If anyone asks such questions, we can explain that the cows have relation with Kṛṣṇa from His boyhood. So the cows have so much, much affection for Kṛṣṇa. And they are hearing Kṛṣṇa’s flute song and seeing Kṛṣṇas’ face, a very good face. They have attraction for Kṛṣṇa. But, really not so [or not like the attraction the gopīs feel], but the gopīs are thinking they do. Even the calves, which are in sakhya-rati, they are like very little boys or girls; they have no nothing, no relation with Kṛṣṇa, because their age is about three days, four days, five days, one month, or less than that. They are also hearing the flute song, and seeing Kṛṣṇa, and thus they ended up in that state. As cows, when they hear Kṛṣṇa’s vaṁśī, they become like mūrcchita.

Devotees: Stunned.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: No sense, and they are grazing, or rather, they were grazing, and theyraised their heads when they heard Kṛṣṇa’s flute, as if wondering what happened.

Devotees: [3:49 inaudible]

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: And all the grass which was there [in the cows’ mouths] came out. They don’t know that all grass is going out. Similarly the calves, who are supported by only milk, not eating any grass at all, they were drinking milk from their mothers. They have in their mouths and when they heard the flute, at once [what was in] their mouth is what? [Dripping out.] They were drinking, yes, but stopped drinking. The cows’...

**Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: …**nipple of the cows.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: …are in the mouths of calves. But they are not at that time sucking.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Drinking.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Not drinking, not taking, not talking – all is stopped. And, Kṛṣṇa is there. Gopīs are seeing. Then Krsna is there; they [the cows and calves] are seeing towards Kṛṣṇas’ face, like gopīs. And, they have taken Kṛṣṇa in their heart. They wanted to embrace Kṛṣṇa – cows and calves both. Cows, like a son, wanted to catch Kṛṣṇa in heart, and they wanted to embrace as a mother embraces her child. And the calves wanted to embrace Kṛṣṇa in their hearts like a very priya sakhā (dear friend).

Navīna Kṛṣṇa Prabhu: Dear, dear friend.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Like gopas, so strongly.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Internally.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Internally. And they fulfilled their ambitions.

Navīna Kṛṣṇa Prabhu: Desires.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Desires. And that is why when they embrace in their hearts, outwardly tears came out. It has been told.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Tear-filled eyes.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: “Śāvāḥ snuta-stana-payaḥ-kavalāḥ sma tasthur, govindam ātmani dṛśāśru-kalāḥ.” Aśru-kalāḥ. Aśru-kalāḥ came. Aśru-kalāḥ means tears.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Full of tears, the eyes full of tears.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Full of tears – cows and also calves, both. They don’t not know anything more than to behold Kṛṣṇa’s face and hear Kṛṣṇa flute voice only. They [the calves] are seeing Kṛṣṇa, not their mothers, and mothers not their calves. They are not seeing grass or anything. They are only seeing Kṛṣṇa.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: I have a question. These cows and calves, where did…did they come from? Kṛṣṇa-loka, or are they doing sādhana from past? Who are they?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Like gopīs they may be both. Sādhana-siddha or nitya-siddha both. Because we see that cows were śruti-mantra (hymns of the Vedas), as [certain classes of] gopīs were śruti-mantra. Most of the cows were [existentially linked] with śloka, mantra, and calves were ṛṣi–muni (sages) also. Hearing all this, a sādhaka can want that we may be like calves and cows.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: But why would a sādhaka prefer to be like a cow or a calf instead of like a mother or a boy?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Because they have svatantratā.

Devotees: Independence.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Independence. In anything, a man can have taste. In taste it cannot be told that why. No reason or…

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Why someone likes one food more than another, you can’t say why.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Because his tendency is like so; he’s free to do anything. A [certain] sādhaka [maybe] wants to be [a] serpent, because Raghunātha dāsa Gosvāmī has told like so:

yat kiñcit tṛṇa-gulma-kīkaṭa-mukhaṁ goṣṭhe samastaṁ hi tat
sarvānandamayaṁ mukunda-dayitaṁ līlānukūlaṁ param
-(Stavāvalī (Vraja-vilāsa-stava 102))

All are sac-cid-ānanda, all trees and everything. If the trees were devotees, why they wanted to be a tree? Because Kṛṣṇa will come in their shade, and He will take fruits, He will come [for] chāyā…

Devotees: Shadow.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Shadow. And, he will climb up the tree.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: A serpent will make Rādhārāṇī go to Kṛṣṇa.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Yes, it will make Her go to Kṛṣṇa and He will come. This will make Kṛṣṇa laugh. Kṛṣṇa and Rādhārāṇī will come together in this way. So, having heard such pastimes, a human can, a sādhaka, can go and he can wish to be so. No reason. Any question? Or another śloka we will take?

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Yes, I have a question.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: But another śloka will take one hour.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Yes, it will take time.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: And this śloka is somewhat important and it makes so explanation, because…

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Then, we will wait for it.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: druma-bhujān…

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: It will be better that we will keep the one hour today, and this way you can allow us to come more regularly, more often. If we control ourselves, and limit ourselves to only one hour, then it will not be much burden on you.

**Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: [**Laughs] Ṭhik (okay).

VERBATIM
Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Today, Rādhā-kuṇḍa bābājī,

Devotee: That one, I think that…

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Or first of Auḍulomī Mahārāja?

Devotees: Yes.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Yesterday, in evening he came, and he was here in night; he wanted to meet me. In the night, he came to me and told [asked] some questions about Bhajana-rahasya that we have given him to translate. [0:45–48 inaudible] And he was telling [saying] at the same time that he has approached gurus, ISKCON, for that…

Devotee: Feeding of sādhus.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: …feeding of sādhus. He told [me] that they [ISKCON gurus] were all accepted [agreed about] our program, but they told that we will consult from Nārāyaṇa Mahārāja.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: We also told him that we had to consult overseas people.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: It will be about me, then they told also that they have consulted with you, but you have not catch their this [message], but like this.

Devotees: Laughing.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: They are not direct, understanding?

Devotee: Yes, yes completely.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: So why my name told them? [Why did you give them my name?]

Devotee: Only him, because he kept telling me I should ask Nārāyaṇa Mahārāja, I should ask Nārāyaṇa Mahārāja. And yesterday he said, ‘What did Nārāyaṇa Mahārāja say? What did Nārāyaṇa Mahārāja say?’

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: I told them frankly, I also told to him.

Devotee: He understands, but he has been in Gauḍīya Maṭha for so long.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: But if name was not out, then it was more better, but I don’t [2:25 inaudible]. I told them that they have some diff…māne they differentiate between Gauḍīya Maṭha and Gauḍīya. Themselves bābājīs. They can take mahāprasādam with sahajiyās, and [with those of] very bad reputations man. And not with Gauḍīya Vaiṣṇavas, who are very learned persons, very qualified, and they know how to do bhajana. They have left everything for Kṛṣṇa. But yet, they don’t take prasādam with them. And they tell that Gauḍīya Vaiṣṇavas has [have] no guru-paramparā. If that is so, they can come to us, we can answer these questions. And you heard from them, and again you go to take money. This is [a] bad thing. We have no consideration about them.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: What did he say?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Bāt to ṭhik hai (It’s fine). It is right. I know that they will not agree. They will not leave their differences. So, we should not be sahānubhūti (empathize) with them. But, I have not…uh manā nahi kiyā (I did not forbidden them), I have not…ki manā nahi (how do I say ‘manā nahi kiyā’?)...

Navīna Kṛṣṇa Prabhu: [translates manā nahi kiyā inaudibly]

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: But I have told the fact. Now they are free to do anything.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: The decision is theirs to make.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Huh?

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: The decision is theirs. If they are prepared to change their philosophy, then we can think about it.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Huh? Then. Hā, I think so. If they should transfer their… all their views, then we should. I’ve done so much good for them. For Rādhā-kuṇḍa and Govardhana. But yet, they are like serpents.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Mahārāja, we have a question.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: What?

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: We’re up to text 13, but we have a question about 12.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Hm, hm, boliye. Tell.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: We were, we were up...you have completed 12, and now you were going to do 13. But we have some questions.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: What? It was 12?

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: You remember.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Dharādharā? Hmm.

Devotee: 11 and 12.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Yeah. In 11 and 12 it’s mentioned; in 12, it mentions that the demigod ladies were flying in their airplanes with their husbands, and both were appreciating Kṛṣṇa. And the gopīs are thinking that certainly they are more fortunate than we, because our husbands will not permit us to leave to be with Kṛṣṇa or anything. So, there’s some question about who are the husbands of the gopīs? Sometimes it is said that they are cowherd boys. So surely they must love Kṛṣṇa very much, then why should they mind if their wives also are with Kṛṣṇa. Other times it is said that actually they have no real husbands, that Yogamāyā has manufactured a duplicate, some husbands who appear to be their husbands. And, any other possible? Like this, different things are said about husbands of the gopīs, so could you please clear? How is it that different statements are there about the gopīs’ husbands?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: You can answer? I want to see your answer.

Devotee: I think you should answer.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Hm, boliye (please say).

Devotee: I cannot answer.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Boliye to (please say)! What will be your answer?

Devotee: My answer is that we could ask you. That is my only answer. I have the same question.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Same question. You can answer. I know that you can answer.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: I asked the question.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: (Laughing) No, no, no but I know that you can answer. You can answer.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: We are all unable to answer.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: No, no, you can answer.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: We are like little parts in the presence of the sun. There’s no light.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: I know that you know the answer.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: I see that there are different explanations given.

Devotee: Also that one about that the gopīs get married to Kṛṣṇa. All the cowherd boys got married, so who did they marry, also?

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: They married Kṛṣṇa during the time, during Brahma-vimohana-līlā. There’s different things are said about the husbands of gopīs. You have told us that the gopīs have no husbands. In Goloka, they only have abhimāna, but actually there are no husbands. Then, one time you told that there’s no Abhimanyu and no Jaṭilā. And then, another time you said to us, without Jaṭilā how can there be Yāvaṭa? So, we have become puzzled by your different explanations.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: (Laughing) No, you should not be puzzled. You should know that this is madhura-līlā. Madhura-līlā is called, where there is aiśvarya or not aiśvarya, they will think only with the eyes of nara. Nara, you know?

Devotees: Human.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Human, only. No aiśvarya. Neither gopīs nor Kṛṣṇa at that time are sarva-antaryāmī.

Navīna Kṛṣṇa Prabhu (Śrīpāda Mādhava Mahārāja): [inaudible] They don’t…. [inaudible]

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: No, it means sarvajñā.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Hā, antaryāmī, they are not antaryāmī.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: All-knowing, all-knowing.

Devotees: Omniscient

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Gopīs are said to be, not intelligent.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Simple girls.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Simple girls. Not as…

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Society girls, like Mathurā…

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: …city girls, no? Very simple. They don’t know anything. They are not so clever.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: They are very clever.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: No, no. No clever, nothing. Very simple heart. So, they don’t know that Yogamāyā has any play in us. If [they were aware that] Yogamāyā does anything, then it [be]comes aiśvarya. But, they have no idea that Yogamāyā is playing any, any…

Devotee: Part.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Any part in this thing. We are simple girls, and we have been married to other gopas. [They] simply don’t know what has become in this; they don’t know anything. And with that guise, in madhura-līlā, they are telling all these things. Understand my view? They don’t know that ‘we have been married to Kṛṣṇa’. They don’t know that ‘we have not [been] married to gopas’. They know only, at that time, that ‘we have married to other gopas’. ‘They are my husband, they are my sister in-law, or mother in-law] – nothing. But when a third person comes, like us, which has no gopī-bhāva; also like Vyāsadeva, also like Śukadeva or Nārada, they know all these details. They [the gopīs] know some details, but they don’t know [everything]. Otherwise, līlā will not take place.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: So, from our, from Nārada’s vision, what is the fact? From Nārada’s vision…

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Nārada’s vision?

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: From the vision of Nārada Muni, what is the fact?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: The fact is that they have been given in marriage to, not given marriage to gopas.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: That is the fact.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: That is the fact. But, what is real is that, what gopīs are seeing. What is this? So, Nārada, Śukadeva Gosvāmī, Vyāsa and all others cannot have so much bhāva as gopī-bhāva. Because they can understand all these things. They are sarvajña, they know all the facts. So, Uddhava also has no bhāva as gopīs. They only have one that bhāva. [They are the only ones who have that bhāva.] We love Kṛṣṇa in stealing [secretive] way, not knowing anything. In a hidden manner, we are doing all these things.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Now, some of the muni-carī gopīs, because they had not yet developed full prema, they got married and had some children. Who did they marry?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Gopas.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: They did get married. And who are those gopas?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Vraja gopas.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Not nitya-siddha gopasl, also sādhana-siddha gopas?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: It may be. Anywhere has not [been] written all these facts, but we…what…sāmañjasya karte hai.

Devotee: Have to reconcile everything somehow.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Hā, reconcile. But if gopīs knew that ‘we have been not married to other gopas’, līlā will be spoiled. If Kṛṣṇa knows that fact, also līlā will be destroyed.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: In Goloka Vṛndāvana, is there…?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: What is written in Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam, we should know that first is true.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: What about Jaṭilā and Abhimanyu?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: They are also, gopīs are seeing them, for līlā. But as a third person. Taṭastha. Taṭastha you know?

Devotee: Neutral.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Neutral.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Neutral. Nothing. Like so. But for līlā it is essential, and it is true.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: So, gopīs can see them.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Gopīs will see.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: But others?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Others means Uddhava and all others.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Can they see Jaṭilā?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: They will see in another thing. That is, that is why Uddhava returned to Mathurā. Nārada Muni cannot enter in Vṛndāvana. And if Kṛṣṇa is always knew [all-knowing], then He could not play like this. He is not playing, but doing actually all these things as a general boy, cowherd boy.

Devotee: Ordinary.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Ordinary. He is doing. And, all this has been done by Yogamāyā.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: That is why Brahmā and Indra became bewildered. They could not believe it.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: So we should think always when we read and then we remember, and do anything, do bhajana. By the eyes of gopīs we see. Otherwise, we cannot enter in this līlā. You should not think that Kṛṣṇa has married them, or there has been marriage not with gopas, and it is only for [by] Yogamāyā’s action.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: But, Jīva Gosvāmī explains it for the general reader, he does explain it, Jīva Gosvāmī.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: But, if we accept Jīva Gosvāmī’s rule, all will be destroyed. He has tried to give the real thing, and that is why līlā will not do.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: But for purpose of explaining generally in a siddhāntika way, then Jīva Gosvāmī’s explanations are valuable, but for entering into bhāva, they are not valuable.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: So, we take only the view of Viśvanātha Cakravartī Ṭhākura. He has not taken anything like that. Anything. Only to give answer of other person, general person, we should know Jīva Gosvāmī’s vicāra. But not for our practices.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Acchā, I agree. But for explanation to others generally.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Others, Jīva Gosvāmī. But, not for rasika-vaiṣṇavas. Don’t explain all these things for a rasika-vaiṣṇava, because he will have to forget all these things, and you will remember all these things. He cannot forget. He cannot enter.

[All laughing]

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Now you have sealed our lips by just saying that.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Yes. [Side comment to someone in Bengali]. Uddhava went to gopīs. He lived [there] so many months. But, he could not have that view. He wanted that view.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: He couldn’t forget.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: And that is why it has been told in Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam:

jñāne prayāsam udapāsya namanta eva
jīvanti san-mukharitāṁ bhavadīya-vārtām
sthāne sthitāḥ śruti-gatāṁ tanu-vāṅ-manobhir
ye prāyaśo ’jita jito ’py asi tais tri-lokyām
[ŚB 10.14.3]

Jñāne prayāsam udapāsya. Here, there is no… it has not been told for nirviśeṣa-jñāna. To remember always Kṛṣṇa that He is God of gods, He is sarva-kāraṇa (cause of all), anādi (beginningless), Himself anādi. We should have to forget all this. We’ll have to reach those who want to be rasika and bhāvuka. And any bhāva of four: dāsya, sakhya, vātsalya, especially three [sakhya, vātsalya, madhura], if anyone… so you’ll have not to always anuśīlana, do anuśīlana of Kṛṣṇa[thinking He] is God of gods. Not as a tattva, advaya-jñāna-paratattva. We have not to think all these things. But always reading and chanting and remembering the pastimes of Kṛṣṇa of Vraja. By doing so, he will know the tattva, how to…māne up to how we have to take jñāna. All will come, and we can enter in līlā. And if we always know that Kṛṣṇa is all, then everything will be [spoiled].

So Gītā is not so much required for rasika-vaiṣṇavas. Because, if we remember always Gītā, then we’ll have to remember that Kṛṣṇa is God of gods.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: But for preaching Gītā is helpful.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: [For] preaching, it is not helpful, but it is essential. Essential. For us, we are not rasika, not bhāvuka, not so, we have no bhāva. So, for us it is not harmful. And if anyone will have bhāva, then automatically everything [else] will go. Only bhāva will come. Bhāva, vibhāva, anubhāva, sāttvika, vyabhicārī will come, and it will enter inside. As [for example] Rūpa Gosvāmī, he has never described all these things. Jīva Gosvāmī has written everything everywhere, in Prīti Sandarbha also.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Did Jīva Gosvāmī do that because he has less vision, or because he was being, this was his duty to do for the conditioned souls?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: For conditioned souls he has done.

Devotee: He is establishing the sampradāya of Mahāprabhu.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Otherwise, he was in the same mood.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Same mood as Raghunātha dāsa Gosvāmī, but Raghunātha dāsa Gosvāmī has nothing [no] interest in all these things.

Devotee: Only weeping.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Only Rūpa Gosvāmī is it, only.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: And Kṛṣṇadāsa Kavirāja Gosvāmī [was] saying Rūpa-Raghunātha.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Both, both. Jīva Gosvāmī first, and then Rūpa Gosvāmī, Raghunātha dāsa Gosvāmī.

Devotee: So much of Caitanya-caritāmṛta, all the philosophy of the Sandarbhas is in there.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: So, everything is of Sandarbhas. What in Sandarbhas he has written? All things he has taken in Caitanya-caritāmṛta. And, rasa-vicāra of Rūpa and Raghunātha. And, he has favored Rūpa-Raghunātha more than all these things.

​​śrī-rūpa-raghunātha-pade yāra āśa
caitanya-caritāmṛta kahe kṛṣṇadāsa
[CC Adi 4.277]

You should go up.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Text 13.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: 13 not 14?

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: 13.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: ​​So, when we read these chapters, we should forget all things that Kṛṣṇa and gopīs are Bhāgavatī and Bhāgavata. We should only take the view of gopīs. What Rūpa Gosvāmī has given.

gāvaś ca kṛṣṇa-mukha-nirgata-veṇu-gīta
pīyūṣam uttabhita-karṇa-puṭaiḥ pibantyaḥ
śāvāḥ snuta-stana-payaḥ-kavalāḥ sma tasthur
govindam ātmani dṛśāśru-kalāḥ spṛśantyaḥ

[Veṇu-gīta, verse 13]

(repeats)
gāvaś ca kṛṣṇa-mukha-nirgata-veṇu-gīta
pīyūṣam uttabhita-karṇa-puṭaiḥ pibantyaḥ
śāvāḥ snuta-stana-payaḥ-kavalāḥ sma tasthur
govindam ātmani dṛśāśru-kalāḥ spṛśantyaḥ

This has been told about ‘devyo’ – ‘devyo vimāna-gatayaḥ smara-nunna-sārā’. Kṛṣṇa-rūpa [Kṛṣṇa’s form], and Kṛṣṇa’s everything is utsava (festival) for gopīs, for all, utsava. Here, the devīs are sumati saubhāgyavatī – fortunate.

Devotee: Fortunate.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: They are seeing. Actually devīs are not so fortunate.

Devotee: Not so fortunate.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Not so fortunate. No bhāva like this. They cannot see the līlās of Kṛṣṇa and gopīs. Also, they cannot come down to Earth. If they have so much bhāva to Kṛṣṇa, they could have come and joined in rasa. Or after rasa they can meet Kṛṣṇa, they can come down to Earth. But they cannot come. But they are seeing, if a deer, if a she-goat. She-goat, you know? Bakarī.

Devotee: Bakarī.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: She comes to Kṛṣṇa, and searching something, grass at His feet, where Kṛṣṇa has kept His feet. And there is a very good grass there. She is searching for grass. But premavatī gopīs (the gopīs, who possess divine love) will see that, ‘Oh, see how fortunate they are. They are going and they are giving their heads to Kṛṣṇa’s feet.’ She-goats have nothing, but yet they [the gopīs] will think. As further we will see. So, gopīs are seeing that whether a deer is…it has no viveka at all. They are foolish, so foolish, they don’t know anything about prīti. But yet, they are loving Kṛṣṇa and hearing the flute’s sweet voice, and giving and dedicated their heart to Kṛṣṇa. And, on other hand, most viveka-śīla (discerned), buddhimān (intelligent).

Devotee: [3:58 inaudible].

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: They are also coming to Kṛṣṇa. The special thing is that, seeing Kṛṣṇa, these devīs don’t know that, our husbands, we are sitting in the laps of our husbands. If a man sees his wife, that she is doing prema to any other person, he will be angry. And he will do anything. But in (this) case the husbands are here, the gopīs are thinking that, ‘Oh, see how wonderful and great fortune is of devīs. In last births they have done something, good work, good thing that they have found such a good husband.’

And they are seeing that they are loving Kṛṣṇa, another [man] than them (the husbands of the devīs). He (Kṛṣṇa) is para-puruṣa [another man]. Para-puruṣa. But yet, they [the demigods] are thinking: “How we are fortunate that we have a wonderful wife, that she has so much prema to Kṛṣṇa. Kṛṣṇa is supernatural Godhead.

Devotees: Supreme God.

**Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: “…**Supreme God. And they have so much love for Kṛṣṇa. We are so fortunate that we are touching (connection) our wives and we have connection with our wives. So, we are so much fortunate.” So, they don’t have any envy or anything with Kṛṣṇa.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: But the husbands of the demigoddesses were not actually…

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: No, gopīs are thinking, whether they have (jealousy) or not, but we’ll have to accept what gopīs are telling. Means, they are seeing that they are in their laps, devīs are. And they are loving their wife, yet knowing all these facts, and they think themselves very fortunate. Because they have any touch (connection) with their wives. They know that they [their wives] love so much that ‘we have not a part of love in us towards Kṛṣṇa [like that of their wives]’. We have naturally…un logo ko yeh rahtā hai. Naturally, kisi par bhakti aur śraddhā hoti hai… we have some faith or anything, who is more qualified than us, and he has some natural bhakti to Kṛṣṇa.

You come to me only for this. And, we love you all because you have kṛṣṇa-bhakti; otherwise no concern, nothing. If he knows that that person has kṛṣṇa-bhakti more than me, we will do praṇāma and we will go and try to serve them.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: We are not merchants like that. You are thinking that we are merchants, but we are not choosing any like this.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: I know. So their husbands are thinking like a bhakta.

Devotee: Anyway, we are only interested in getting back our hearts, we have come here to get back our stolen property.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: So, the nature of bhakti is like this. When he sees that he has love (and) affection for Kṛṣṇa, he gives everything to that. So, he is thinking [the demigods are thinking they are] so much fortunate…māne demigods [think they are] so much fortunate: ‘We have such, so good quality of wives, that they have so much affection that their all flowers from [their hair] goes away. And they don’t know where we are. They saw Kṛṣṇa and they heard the flute svara (sound), and they had became senseless in our…[laps]. If I had so much affection for Kṛṣṇa, I would be very fortunate’. So they have so much honor for their wives. ‘But, in our case it is just the opposite [the gopīs say]. If our husbands will hear, and will see, and if they will see, they can do anything. If we be a devī, and [then] we’ll have so much occasion to see Kṛṣṇa.’ They won’t see, if they cannot come to Earth, they cannot join Kṛṣṇa’s pastimes, they cannot sparśa – touch the feet of Kṛṣṇa, they cannot bath in Kṛṣṇa’s feet dust, but yet they are wonderfully fortunate. So, if you’ll have a birth like so, it will be so much fortunate.

Now, where their…this sight goes, they see only kṛṣṇa-uddīpanā. Gopīs, uddīpanā they see, everywhere. They are very clever, māne (I mean), the devīs. But their [the gopīs’] standard is so high. At the same time, they saw towards everything of Vraja: trees, deer, persons, cows. They began…they began to tell about cows, how cows are feeling. Here, we are telling:

gāvaś ca kṛṣṇa-mukha-nirgata-veṇu-gīta…

[In Hindi] Keep track of the time. We should not go over an hour.

gāvaś ca kṛṣṇa-mukha-nirgata-veṇu-gīta
pīyūṣam uttabhita-karṇa-puṭaiḥ pibantyaḥ

‘Oh see, cows are so much fortunate. They thought that, we cannot be the wives of demigods, devīs. But, see how cows are feeling – kṛṣṇa-mukha-nirgata-veṇu-gīta. Kṛṣṇa is playing on flute, and from vaṁśī is coming nectar, so they are drinking. How they are drinking? By…

Devotees: Ears.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Ears. Their ears…

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Like cups.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Cups, but down. In ordinary [ordinarily] cows’ [ears are] down, but when they are hearing, they are like so [upright]. Why? Because it is cup [their ears are like cups]. What we are hearing should not fall down. Should [they] do like so [raise their ears]. Sometimes, they close their eyes and tears are coming. Also, milk is coming down automatically from their…

Devotee: Udder, u-d-d-e-r.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Udder. Automatically, not for calf, calves.

pīyūṣam uttabhita-karṇa-puṭaiḥ pibantyaḥ – That, to come out milk [for milk to flow spontaneously] is a symptom of vātsalya-rasa.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Like mother Yaśodā.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Mother Yaśodā. So, they are like mothers.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: It’s an anubhāva.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Anubhāva, like mothers. They are of vātsalya-rasa. In Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam everywhere it is written like so. They have so much affection. Gopīs are seeing that for so many years, Kṛṣṇa is grazing them. He goes and comes and He also makes them bath in sarovara (lake) and milk, sometimes do like this.

Devotee: Patting and petting.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Padding, padding.

Devotee: Petting, p-e-t-t-i-n-g.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Petting them. So naturally, with whom anyone lives, they have some relation and some prīti. Why Kṛṣṇa, He at firsts only goes to graze, only calves, in boyhood? But why He afterward in Vṛndāvana He goes with only calves, but in Nandagaon He takes cows and goes to graze. Why cows? Because, the calves which were with Kṛṣṇa, grazing, they became bigger. And they have practiced to go with Kṛṣṇa, so when they become like cows, first pregnant, and first bacchā [baby] came. They cannot go with other, older persons. Yet they wanted to go with Kṛṣṇa and they daily used to go with Kṛṣṇa, whether they have… so all the calves, up till now, when Kṛṣṇa went in paugaṇḍa [from five to ten years], they become cows. From boyhood, Kṛṣṇa used to [be] petting them and show[ing] much love [and] affection for them. Now cows [those calves]...have become cows, yet they have so much prīti, and cow has also prīti with Krsna. So, cows are as a mother, affectionate to Kṛṣṇa, and giving milk.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: I have a question. When they were small calves, what was the loving mood they had?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Who?

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: When the cows were small, when Kṛṣṇa was taking them out when He was young in Vṛndāvana, what was the mood of those small calves? What kind of rasa?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: No rasa. As girls…

Navīna Kṛṣṇa Prabhu (Śrīpāda Mādhava Mahārāja: sakhya-rati.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: …sakhya-rati. After, they have rasa. If anyone asks questions that cows has relation with Kṛṣṇa from boyhood. So cows have so much, much affection for Kṛṣṇa. And they are hearing from Kṛṣṇa’s lotus…uh, veṇu-gīta, and seeing Kṛṣṇas’ face, very good face. They have attraction for Kṛṣṇa. But, really not so, gopīs are thinking. Even the calves, which are in sakhya-rati, they are very little boy, they have no nothing, no relation with Kṛṣṇa, because their age is about three days, four days, five days, one month, or less than that. They are also hearing flute voice, and seeing Kṛṣṇa, and they became in that state. As cows, when they hear the Kṛṣṇa-vaṁśī, they become like mūrcchita.

Devotees: Stunned.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: No sense, and they are grazing, they were grazing, and they mukha ko uṭhā diyā (raised their heads when they heard Kṛṣṇa’s flute). Kyā huā (wondering what happened).

Devotees: [3:49 inaudible]

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: And all the grass which was there [in the cows’ mouths] came out. They don’t know that all grass is going out. Similarly the calves, only they are supported by only milk, no grass at all. They were drinking milk from their mothers. They have, their milk was there [in their mouths], and when they heard [the flute], at once [what was in] their mouth is in…what? They were drinking, yes, but stopped drinking. The cows’ …are…

**Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: …**nipple of the cows.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: …are in the mouths of calves. But they are not at that time chūsing (sucking).

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Drinking.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Drinking, not taking, talking. All is stopped. And, Kṛṣṇa is there. Gopīs are seeing. Then Krsna is there; they [the cows] are seeing towards Kṛṣṇas’ face, like gopīs…like cows. And, they have taken Kṛṣṇa in their heart. They wanted to embrace Kṛṣṇa – cows and calves both. Cows, like a son, wanted to catch Kṛṣṇa in heart, and they wanted to embrace as a mother embraces her child. And they [the calves] wanted to embrace Kṛṣṇa in their hearts like a very priya sakhā (dear friend).

Navīna Kṛṣṇa Prabhu: Dear, dear friend.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Like gopas, so strongly.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Internally.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Internally. And they fulfilled their ambitions.

Navīna Kṛṣṇa Prabhu: Desires.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Desires. And that is why when they embrace in inner heart, outwardly tears came out. It has been told.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Tear-filled eyes.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: “Śāvāḥ snuta-stana-payaḥ-kavalāḥ sma tasthur, govindam ātmani dṛśāśru-kalāḥ.” Aśru-kalāḥ. Aśru-kalāḥ came. Aśru-kalāḥ means tears.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Full of tears, the eyes full of tears.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Full of tears of gopa…cows and also calves both. That is why, and though they did not know anything more than [behold] Kṛṣṇa’s face and hear Kṛṣṇa flute voice only. They [the calves] are seeing Kṛṣṇa, not their mothers, and mothers not their calves. No grass, nothing, they are seeing, only they are seeing towards Kṛṣṇa.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: I have a question. These cows and calves, where did…did they come from Kṛṣṇa-loka, or are they doing sādhana from past? Who are they?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Like gopīs they may be both. Sādhana-siddha or nitya-siddha both. Because we see that cows were śruti-mantra (hymns of the Vedas), as [certain] gopīs [were] śruti-mantra. Most of the cows were [existentially linked] with śloka, mantra, and calves were ṛṣi–muni (sages) also. Hearing all this, a sādhaka can want that we may be like calves and cows.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: But why would a sādhaka prefer to be like a cow or a calf instead of like a mother or a boy?

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Because they have svatantratā.

Devotees: Independence.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Independence. In anything, a man can have taste. In taste it cannot be told that why. No reason or…

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Why someone likes one food more than another, you can’t say why.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Because his tendency is like so; he’s free to do anything. A [certain] sādhaka [maybe] wants to be [a] serpent, because Raghunātha dāsa Gosvāmī has told like so:

yat kiñcit tṛṇa-gulma-kīkaṭa-mukhaṁ goṣṭhe samastaṁ hi tat
sarvānandamayaṁ mukunda-dayitaṁ līlānukūlaṁ param
-(Stavāvalī (Vraja-vilāsa-stava 102))

All are sac-cid-ānanda, all trees and everything. If the trees were devotees, why they wanted to be a tree? Because Kṛṣṇa will come in their shade, and He will take fruits, He will come [for] chāyā…

Devotees: Shadow.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Shadow. And, he will climb up the tree.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: A serpent will make Rādhārāṇī go to Kṛṣṇa.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: Go and He will come. So, Kṛṣṇa laughs, Kṛṣṇa, Rādhārāṇī will come. So, having heard so, human can, a sādhaka can go and he can wish to be so. No reason. Any question? Or another śloka we will take?

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Yes, I have a question.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: But another śloka will take one hour.

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Yes, it will take time.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: And this śloka is somewhat important and it makes so explanation, because…

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: Then, we will wait for it.

Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: druma-bhujān…

Śrīpād Tamāl Kṛṣṇa Mahārāja: It will be better that we will keep the one hour today, and this way you can allow us to come more regularly, more often. If we control ourselves, and limit ourselves to only one hour, then it will not be much burden on you.

**Śrīla Nārāyaṇa Gosvāmī Mahārāja: [**Laughs] Ṭhik (okay).

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